FreeMarker doesn't work on Google App Engine due to usage of Swing

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Daniel Dekany

FreeMarker doesn't work on Google App Engine due to usage of Swing

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Guys, have you noticed this?
https://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=2880518&group_id=794&atid=100794

So what do you think?

--
Best regards,
 Daniel Dekany


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Guo Du

Re: FreeMarker doesn't work on Google App Engine due to usage of Swing

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On Sun, Oct 18, 2009 at 12:12 PM, Daniel Dekany <[hidden email]> wrote:
> Guys, have you noticed this?
> https://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=2880518&group_id=794&atid=100794
>
> So what do you think?

Feel like swing (javax.swing.*) is not required to run server side
application. If it's required by freemarker, might be a freemarker
design flaw.  It doesn't sound correct to ask AppEngine to break their
policy because of our defect.

We may fix in next major release brunches. And people interested with
the freemarker on AppEngine, could get from there. I understand there
are associated cost to do this, and not a push to see this happen
soon, could be on the roadmap.

First time post here and hope to be nice :)

-Guo

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Daniel Dekany

Re: FreeMarker doesn't work on Google App Engine due to usage of Swing

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Sunday, October 18, 2009, 2:20:01 PM, Guo Du wrote:

> On Sun, Oct 18, 2009 at 12:12 PM, Daniel Dekany <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> Guys, have you noticed this?
>> https://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=2880518&group_id=794&atid=100794
>>
>> So what do you think?
>
> Feel like swing (javax.swing.*) is not required to run server side
> application. If it's required by freemarker, might be a freemarker
> design flaw.

Some of the classes implement/extend Swing stuff because the author
thought that it's convenient for tree-traversing in some 3rd party
tools. It's all just about tree traversal, not about graphics or user
input or like, so it should work even if there is no display or user
input in the runtime environment.

> It doesn't sound correct to ask AppEngine to break their
> policy because of our defect.

FreeMarker 2.3.x was written for the J2SE 1.X platform (1.2+), and I'm
not sure at all that Google App Engine implements that platform
correctly. I mean, if there is no "display" then throwing exception
when someone tries to create a window is absolutely OK, but that the
Swing classes/interfaces are totally missing strikes me as odd. But,
whatever... even if they were wrong, we still have to target their
platform, Google App Engine.

> We may fix in next major release brunches. And people interested with
> the freemarker on AppEngine, could get from there. I understand there
> are associated cost to do this, and not a push to see this happen
> soon, could be on the roadmap.

I think we should create freemarker.core classes that correspond to
the Swing classes, and we should delete FreemarkerTreeView. That way
it's easy to adapt for those who happened to use those classes. Then
we bite the bullet and release it in the 2.3.x series, despite it's
not 100% backward compatible. I think less users will curse us this
way than if FreeMarker doesn't work on Google App Engine... /-:

> First time post here and hope to be nice :)
>
> -Guo

--
Best regards,
 Daniel Dekany


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Guo Du

Re: FreeMarker doesn't work on Google App Engine due to usage of Swing

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2009/10/18 Daniel Dekany <[hidden email]>:
>
> Some of the classes implement/extend Swing stuff because the author
> thought that it's convenient for tree-traversing in some 3rd party
> tools. It's all just about tree traversal, not about graphics or user
> input or like, so it should work even if there is no display or user
> input in the runtime environment.

I believe author was right at the time when he create freemarker. We
don't need reinvent some basic function especially they are part of
standard jre distribution. Unfortunately, the swing package was baned
by AppEngine even they are part of OSGi system packages.

> I think we should create freemarker.core classes that correspond to
> the Swing classes, and we should delete FreemarkerTreeView. That way

Even use freemarker for some years, but didn't look too much in it's
implementation. Because it just works :) There are some exist
library/packages [org.w3c.dom, Apache Xerces] does the tree style
operations. And I am sure those package are safe in most of
environment.

> it's easy to adapt for those who happened to use those classes. Then
> we bite the bullet and release it in the 2.3.x series, despite it's
> not 100% backward compatible. I think less users will curse us this
> way than if FreeMarker doesn't work on Google App Engine... /-:

If it's not suppose to be 100% backward compatible, we'd better put in
a major/minor release, at least not in maintenance release[1]. As
freemarker is  widely used in community/production system, it doesn't
worth to break 2.3.x stable release code base just because of
AppEngine. IMO, AppEnine is still experimental, not ready for serious
application.


[1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Software_versioning#Sequence-based_identifiers

Thank you very much and enjoy the remain weekend!

-Guo

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