Thunder-Sky batteries

[Peter_VanDerWal]

> Victor,
>
> Were your batteries the same type and chemistry that they are offering
> today?  I heard that they switched from cobalt to iron phosphate.
>

It's the same company and their business ethics haven't changed...much.

At least now they will tell you (if you ask them) that their warranty is
only good if the batteries never leave China.

Once you load them on the boat, they don't even guarantee that they will
make good paper weights.


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[Roger Heuckeroth]

Victor,

Were your batteries the same type and chemistry that they are offering  
today?  I heard that they switched from cobalt to iron phosphate.


On Jul 10, 2008, at 2:13 AM, Victor Tikhonov wrote:

> This sounds oh so familiar...
>
> Good luck with your purchase. Personally, I wouldn't take
> their brand new batteries even for free, but YMMV.
>
> You've been warned.
>
> --
> Victor
> '91 ACRX - something different
> '01 in-AUDI-ble - handsome car with 0.4 MW AC drive (in works)
>
>
> Duff Kindt wrote:
>> I am ordering batteries directly from Thunder Sky . These will be 90
>> AH and 160 AH LFP's.  If there is any interest let me know as the
>> larger the order the lower the price. Sincerely Duff Kindt
>> _______________________________________________ For general EVDL
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>>
>>
>>
>
>
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[Neon John]

On Thu, 10 Jul 2008 01:35:54 -0600 (MDT), "Peter VanDerWal"
<[hidden email]> wrote:

>> Victor,
>>
>> Were your batteries the same type and chemistry that they are offering
>> today?  I heard that they switched from cobalt to iron phosphate.
>>
>
>It's the same company and their business ethics haven't changed...much.
>
>At least now they will tell you (if you ask them) that their warranty is
>only good if the batteries never leave China.

I didn't know you had any direct experience with them, Peter.  Is this really
just information that you've heard that you're repeating?

>
>Once you load them on the boat, they don't even guarantee that they will
>make good paper weights.

This is the classic chinese merchant market (you buy what they offer instead
of having them manufacture to your specs.) conundrum. The "company" (even the
definition of that is hazy sometimes.) may or may not know anything about what
they're making.  They may just be mechanically cloning someone else's product.
Or cloning the working part and putting a cheaper case around it.

The conundrum is thus.  If I can buy a product for a third or a fifth or
whatever of the free world market price, is it worth the risk, knowing that
there is no QC and that I'll be doing my own QC?  For many things, the answer
is YES.  I buy 18650 cells from china knowing that about 1 out of 5 will be
bad.  But since I buy them for a fraction of what US prices are and since I
have the time to sort 'em, it's a good deal for me.

If the failure rate of the current Thundersky batteries isn't too great then
they may be a terrific deal.  I don't know, since I have neither the price nor
the failure rate data.  A large group buy with everyone ordering a few more
batteries than he actually needs would seem to minimize the risk.

If I were digging coins out of the beach using a metal detector to pay for
batteries, I'd certainly not take the risk.  OTOH, if the money that I would
spend on them is (semi) disposable income then the risk is probably worth it.

It's a fallacy to think that one can buy batteries this cheap compared to free
world manufactured batteries and still get free-world-like quality.  It's not
a moral issue at all.  It's simply the way the chinese do business and in this
case, they seem to be open about it.

John

--
John De Armond
See my website for my current email address
http://www.neon-john.com
http://www.johndearmond.com <-- best little blog on the net!
Tellico Plains, Occupied TN
Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge. -Darwin


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[AMPrentice]

These are the same reasons and logic the first group got ripped off.
You are not highlighting anything new, even with a new chemistry
you are supporting a company that has screwed our community.
With the many companies there are out there doing the same you
might at least try a different one.
Why give the same scum a chance to rape others?
Its beyond moral its purely a lack of logic.

Neon John wrote:

On Thu, 10 Jul 2008 01:35:54 -0600 (MDT), "Peter VanDerWal"
<[e-mail]> wrote:

>> Victor,
>>
>> Were your batteries the same type and chemistry that they are offering
>> today?  I heard that they switched from cobalt to iron phosphate.
>>
>
>It's the same company and their business ethics haven't changed...much.
>
>At least now they will tell you (if you ask them) that their warranty is
>only good if the batteries never leave China.

I didn't know you had any direct experience with them, Peter.  Is this really
just information that you've heard that you're repeating?

>
>Once you load them on the boat, they don't even guarantee that they will
>make good paper weights.

This is the classic chinese merchant market (you buy what they offer instead
of having them manufacture to your specs.) conundrum. The "company" (even the
definition of that is hazy sometimes.) may or may not know anything about what
they're making.  They may just be mechanically cloning someone else's product.
Or cloning the working part and putting a cheaper case around it.

The conundrum is thus.  If I can buy a product for a third or a fifth or
whatever of the free world market price, is it worth the risk, knowing that
there is no QC and that I'll be doing my own QC?  For many things, the answer
is YES.  I buy 18650 cells from china knowing that about 1 out of 5 will be
bad.  But since I buy them for a fraction of what US prices are and since I
have the time to sort 'em, it's a good deal for me.

If the failure rate of the current Thundersky batteries isn't too great then
they may be a terrific deal.  I don't know, since I have neither the price nor
the failure rate data.  A large group buy with everyone ordering a few more
batteries than he actually needs would seem to minimize the risk.

If I were digging coins out of the beach using a metal detector to pay for
batteries, I'd certainly not take the risk.  OTOH, if the money that I would
spend on them is (semi) disposable income then the risk is probably worth it.

It's a fallacy to think that one can buy batteries this cheap compared to free
world manufactured batteries and still get free-world-like quality.  It's not
a moral issue at all.  It's simply the way the chinese do business and in this
case, they seem to be open about it.

John

--
John De Armond
See my website for my current email address
http://www.neon-john.com
http://www.johndearmond.com <-- best little blog on the net!
Tellico Plains, Occupied TN
Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge. -Darwin


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[cowtown]

> These are the same reasons and logic the first group got ripped off.
> You are not highlighting anything new, even with a new chemistry
> you are supporting a company that has screwed our community.
> With the many companies there are out there doing the same you
> might at least try a different one.
> Why give the same scum a chance to rape others? Its beyond moral its  
> purely a lack of logic.

No, it's DF (dumbf^ck) logic - if it's cheap, nothing else matters.


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[AMPrentice]

when other companies are available with the same cost or cheaper
The DF Logic makes even Walmart Bovine seem intelligent.

cowtown wrote:

> These are the same reasons and logic the first group got ripped off.
> You are not highlighting anything new, even with a new chemistry
> you are supporting a company that has screwed our community.
> With the many companies there are out there doing the same you
> might at least try a different one.
> Why give the same scum a chance to rape others? Its beyond moral its  
> purely a lack of logic.

No, it's DF (dumbf^ck) logic - if it's cheap, nothing else matters.


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[EVDL Administrator]

Let's be careful with this thread, folks; please don't get into personal
comments.  Stick to facts.  Make sure you're discussing EVs, not EVDL
members.

Thanks.

David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
EVDL Administrator

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[Peter_VanDerWal]

> Can someone point me to those who have purchased and been burned.
> What was the issue?  No goods?  Poor quality? etc?
> What could be done to remedy the transaction?

First of all, ThunderySky (TS) has pretty poor quality control, this has
been verified by list members who have actually traveled to the factory in
China.

Even still some batteries that TS makes, fail their own quality control.

Several years ago Victor at MetricMind put together a group buy of TS
batteries.
TS had a bunch of batteries sitting on a dock that failed their own QC,
not wanting to loose the money they put into building these batteries,
they bundled them up and shipped them to Victor.
TS has admitted they did this.

The only folks that could remedy this is TS, TS has stated that this
happened in the past, the transaction is completed, they have no intention
of doing anything about it.
They now say that the batteries are experimental and you get what you get,
no refunds, no returns.

Jukka Jarvinen (a European businessman) used to have an office at the TS
plant.  He would go there and personally test every battery he bought to
make sure it worked before loading them into containers for shipment. Even
so, he ended up with a batch that had internal corrosion problems and they
failed within a year.
Now this was probably one of TS's largest foreign customers, for him their
policy was...you get what you get, no refunds, no returns.

Apparently some folks have gotten good batteries from TS, but it's a total
crap shoot.

Personally, even if I was willing to take the gamble, I'm not willing to
do business with a company that has demonstrated a policy of intentionally
screwing their customers.

>
> The cost of traditional methods of LiFePO4 is beyond my means,
> but this would be a reasonable stretch.
>
> Without batteries in this ball park, I think I continue to guzzle gas --
> so
> I am
> quite intrigued by the history of this thread.
>
> Yes I could use AGM -- but I think the performance to weight is not there
> in
> the application
> I am planning.
>
> thanks,
>
> m
>
>
>
>
> EVDL Administrator wrote:
>>
>> Let's be careful with this thread, folks; please don't get into personal
>> comments.  Stick to facts.  Make sure you're discussing EVs, not EVDL
>> members.
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>> David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
>> EVDL Administrator
>>
>> = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
>> EVDL Information: http://www.evdl.org/help/
>> = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
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>> reach me.  To send a private message, please obtain my
>> email address from the webpage http://www.evdl.org/help/ .
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>>
>>
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>>
>>
>
> --
> View this message in context:
> http://www.nabble.com/Thunder-Sky-batteries-tp18330177p18403188.html
> Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at
> Nabble.com.
>
>
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>
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[txhokie4life]

I'm new to the EV group,
new to EVs
and new to the Chinese Battery escapades.

Can someone point me to those who have purchased and been burned.

What was the issue?  No goods?  Poor quality? etc?

What could be done to remedy the transaction?

The cost of traditional methods of LiFePO4 is beyond my means,
but this would be a reasonable stretch.

Without batteries in this ball park, I think I continue to guzzle gas -- so I am
quite intrigued by the history of this thread.

Yes I could use AGM -- but I think the performance to weight is not there in the application
I am planning.

thanks,

m

EVDL Administrator wrote:

Let's be careful with this thread, folks; please don't get into personal
comments.  Stick to facts.  Make sure you're discussing EVs, not EVDL
members.

Thanks.

David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
EVDL Administrator

= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
EVDL Information: http://www.evdl.org/help/
= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
Note: mail sent to "evpost" or "etpost" addresses will not
reach me.  To send a private message, please obtain my
email address from the webpage http://www.evdl.org/help/ .
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[roddilkes]

Just FYI I have a set of 45 TS LFP90AHA cells running in my EV for 18 months now.
They are still behaving like the day I bought them.

Regards, Rod Dilkes
www.ev-power.com.au

[Roger Heuckeroth]

Just out of curiosity, how much voltage sag are you experiencing at  
load?  You say they are holding up, but at what performance?


On Jul 17, 2008, at 10:41 AM, roddilkes wrote:

>
> Just FYI I have a set of 45 TS LFP90AHA cells running in my EV for  
> 18 months
> now.
> They are still behaving like the day I bought them.
>
> Regards, Rod Dilkes
> www.ev-power.com.au
>
>
> --
> View this message in context: http://www.nabble.com/Thunder-Sky-batteries-tp18330177p18510061.html
> Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive  
> at Nabble.com.
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> For general EVDL support, see http://evdl.org/help/
> For subscription options, see http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ 
> ev

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[Bill Dennis]

At 100A, they're sagging below 100V.  That's from a nominal 126V pack.
Right now, pack is resting at 131V.  So at .35C, I'm getting a 31V sag.

Bill

Original Message:
-----------------
From: Roger Heuckeroth [hidden email]
Date: Thu, 17 Jul 2008 11:04:47 -0400
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Thunder-Sky batteries


Just out of curiosity, how much voltage sag are you experiencing at  
load?  You say they are holding up, but at what performance?


On Jul 17, 2008, at 10:41 AM, roddilkes wrote:

>
> Just FYI I have a set of 45 TS LFP90AHA cells running in my EV for  
> 18 months
> now.
> They are still behaving like the day I bought them.
>
> Regards, Rod Dilkes
> www.ev-power.com.au
>
>
> --
> View this message in context:

http://www.nabble.com/Thunder-Sky-batteries-tp18330177p18510061.html
> Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive  
> at Nabble.com.
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> For general EVDL support, see http://evdl.org/help/
> For subscription options, see http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ 
> ev


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[roddilkes]

Sag is temperature dependent.
It is winter over here now with temperatures around 10-15 Celcius
But I can still pull 3C (270A) without sagging below 2.5V per cell.
Summer gives better performance in my experience.

TS LFP do not provide the same performance as say Optima SLAs.
For range there is no contest though.

Regards, Rod Dilkes
www.ev-power.com.au

Roger Heuckeroth wrote:

Just out of curiosity, how much voltage sag are you experiencing at  
load?  You say they are holding up, but at what performance?


On Jul 17, 2008, at 10:41 AM, roddilkes wrote:

>
> Just FYI I have a set of 45 TS LFP90AHA cells running in my EV for  
> 18 months
> now.
> They are still behaving like the day I bought them.
>
> Regards, Rod Dilkes
> www.ev-power.com.au
>
>
> --
> View this message in context: http://www.nabble.com/Thunder-Sky-batteries-tp18330177p18510061.html
> Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive  
> at Nabble.com.
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> For general EVDL support, see http://evdl.org/help/
> For subscription options, see http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ 
> ev


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[Bill Dennis]

For me right now, cold is not the problem--in fact, just the opposite.  
Temps are 35 degrees C right now.  And after I've climbed that hill to
home, my pack is up to 45 degrees C.  I'm actually going to have to add
some active cooling.

Bill Dennis

roddilkes wrote:

> Sag is temperature dependent.
> It is winter over here now with temperatures around 10-15 Celcius
> But I can still pull 3C (270A) without sagging below 2.5V per cell.
> Summer gives better performance in my experience.
>
> TS LFP do not provide the same performance as say Optima SLAs.
> For range there is no contest though.
>
> Regards, Rod Dilkes
> www.ev-power.com.au
>
>
>
> Roger Heuckeroth wrote:
>  
>> Just out of curiosity, how much voltage sag are you experiencing at  
>> load?  You say they are holding up, but at what performance?
>>
>>
>> On Jul 17, 2008, at 10:41 AM, roddilkes wrote:
>>
>>    
>>> Just FYI I have a set of 45 TS LFP90AHA cells running in my EV for  
>>> 18 months
>>> now.
>>> They are still behaving like the day I bought them.
>>>
>>> Regards, Rod Dilkes
>>> www.ev-power.com.au
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> View this message in context:
>>> http://www.nabble.com/Thunder-Sky-batteries-tp18330177p18510061.html
>>> Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive  
>>> at Nabble.com.
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> For general EVDL support, see http://evdl.org/help/
>>> For subscription options, see http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ 
>>> ev
>>>      
>> _______________________________________________
>> For general EVDL support, see http://evdl.org/help/
>> For subscription options, see http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>>
>>
>>
>>    
>
>  

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[roddilkes]

TS LFP (Iron Phosphate) and LCP (Cobalt) are different animals.
LFP cells have a lower internal resistance so don't self heat much.
At least from my experience...

Rod

Bill Dennis-2 wrote:

For me right now, cold is not the problem--in fact, just the opposite.  
Temps are 35 degrees C right now.  And after I've climbed that hill to
home, my pack is up to 45 degrees C.  I'm actually going to have to add
some active cooling.

Bill Dennis

roddilkes wrote:
> Sag is temperature dependent.
> It is winter over here now with temperatures around 10-15 Celcius
> But I can still pull 3C (270A) without sagging below 2.5V per cell.
> Summer gives better performance in my experience.
>
> TS LFP do not provide the same performance as say Optima SLAs.
> For range there is no contest though.
>
> Regards, Rod Dilkes
> www.ev-power.com.au
>
>
>
> Roger Heuckeroth wrote:
>  
>> Just out of curiosity, how much voltage sag are you experiencing at  
>> load?  You say they are holding up, but at what performance?
>>
>>
>> On Jul 17, 2008, at 10:41 AM, roddilkes wrote:
>>
>>    
>>> Just FYI I have a set of 45 TS LFP90AHA cells running in my EV for  
>>> 18 months
>>> now.
>>> They are still behaving like the day I bought them.
>>>
>>> Regards, Rod Dilkes
>>> www.ev-power.com.au
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> View this message in context:
>>> http://www.nabble.com/Thunder-Sky-batteries-tp18330177p18510061.html
>>> Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive  
>>> at Nabble.com.
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> For general EVDL support, see http://evdl.org/help/
>>> For subscription options, see http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ 
>>> ev
>>>      
>> _______________________________________________
>> For general EVDL support, see http://evdl.org/help/
>> For subscription options, see http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>>
>>
>>
>>    
>
>  


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[Roger Heuckeroth]

Bill,

I was thinking about your battery configuration and have some  
thoughts.  Normally, when Lithium series parallel battery packs are  
constructed by manufacturers they first wire sets of batteries in  
parallel, and then string those sets in series.  The parallel packs  
essentially become one big cell electrically. Each parallel pack has  
an overcharge voltage regulator that limits the voltage to the  
specified level.  Then a separate circuit monitors the voltage during  
discharge and cuts off the pack if any parallel pack voltage gets to  
the minimum discharge level.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but you probably wired all the 90 Ah cells in  
series, and all the 200 Ah cells in series, and then just paralleled  
the two series strings.  Is that right?  If so, I'm wondering if  
instead of the strings working together, the weaker string may be  
pulling the stronger string down with it.

Let's assume the 90 Ah string has more sag than the 200 Ah string.  
So, could the 200 Ah string then essentially be handicapped by the 90  
Ah string and some of the current out of the 200 Ah string is going to  
the motor and some current is going to the 90 Ah string.

If this is indeed what is happening you could verify this with a set  
of shunts and ameters.  When you put the pack under load you could see  
where the current is coming from.

If I'm wrong here, please someone correct my logic.  I am a EE by  
degree, but practice more environmental engineering than electrical  
engineering.  Just a thought...
On Jul 18, 2008, at 12:33 AM, Bill Dennis wrote:

> For me right now, cold is not the problem--in fact, just the opposite.
> Temps are 35 degrees C right now.  And after I've climbed that hill to
> home, my pack is up to 45 degrees C.  I'm actually going to have to  
> add
> some active cooling.
>
> Bill Dennis
>
> roddilkes wrote:
>> Sag is temperature dependent.
>> It is winter over here now with temperatures around 10-15 Celcius
>> But I can still pull 3C (270A) without sagging below 2.5V per cell.
>> Summer gives better performance in my experience.
>>
>> TS LFP do not provide the same performance as say Optima SLAs.
>> For range there is no contest though.
>>
>> Regards, Rod Dilkes
>> www.ev-power.com.au
>>
>>
>>
>> Roger Heuckeroth wrote:
>>
>>> Just out of curiosity, how much voltage sag are you experiencing at
>>> load?  You say they are holding up, but at what performance?
>>>
>>>
>>> On Jul 17, 2008, at 10:41 AM, roddilkes wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>> Just FYI I have a set of 45 TS LFP90AHA cells running in my EV for
>>>> 18 months
>>>> now.
>>>> They are still behaving like the day I bought them.
>>>>
>>>> Regards, Rod Dilkes
>>>> www.ev-power.com.au
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> View this message in context:
>>>> http://www.nabble.com/Thunder-Sky-batteries- 
>>>> tp18330177p18510061.html
>>>> Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive
>>>> at Nabble.com.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> For general EVDL support, see http://evdl.org/help/
>>>> For subscription options, see http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/
>>>> ev
>>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> For general EVDL support, see http://evdl.org/help/
>>> For subscription options, see http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>
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> ev

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[Jeff928]

Hey Rod,
 I sent a quote request earlyer today for your bms
setup.
 I have another question though. What is the open
circuit voltage after the lfp cells come off the
charger. Say after at least 5minutes.
  I thinking of adding more cells to above my current
sla battery setup if I go with lfp200 to compensate
for say. I need to be below 190volts on my raptor 1200
controller before I precharge it or bad things can
happen :(
Thanks,
Jeff McCabe
--- roddilkes <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
> TS LFP (Iron Phosphate) and LCP (Cobalt) are
> different animals.
> LFP cells have a lower internal resistance so don't
> self heat much.
> At least from my experience...
>
> Rod
>
>
> Bill Dennis-2 wrote:
> >
> > For me right now, cold is not the problem--in
> fact, just the opposite.  
> > Temps are 35 degrees C right now.  And after I've
> climbed that hill to
> > home, my pack is up to 45 degrees C.  I'm actually
> going to have to add
> > some active cooling.
> >
> > Bill Dennis
> >
> > roddilkes wrote:
> >> Sag is temperature dependent.
> >> It is winter over here now with temperatures
> around 10-15 Celcius
> >> But I can still pull 3C (270A) without sagging
> below 2.5V per cell.
> >> Summer gives better performance in my experience.
> >>
> >> TS LFP do not provide the same performance as say
> Optima SLAs.
> >> For range there is no contest though.
> >>
> >> Regards, Rod Dilkes
> >> www.ev-power.com.au
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Roger Heuckeroth wrote:
> >>  
> >>> Just out of curiosity, how much voltage sag are
> you experiencing at  
> >>> load?  You say they are holding up, but at what
> performance?
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On Jul 17, 2008, at 10:41 AM, roddilkes wrote:
> >>>
> >>>    
> >>>> Just FYI I have a set of 45 TS LFP90AHA cells
> running in my EV for  
> >>>> 18 months
> >>>> now.
> >>>> They are still behaving like the day I bought
> them.
> >>>>
> >>>> Regards, Rod Dilkes
> >>>> www.ev-power.com.au
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> --
> >>>> View this message in context:
> >>>>
>

http://www.nabble.com/Thunder-Sky-batteries-tp18330177p18510061.html

> >>>> Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List
> mailing list archive  
> >>>> at Nabble.com.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>> For general EVDL support, see
> http://evdl.org/help/
> >>>> For subscription options, see
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ 
> >>>> ev
> >>>>      
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>> For general EVDL support, see
> http://evdl.org/help/
> >>> For subscription options, see
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>    
> >>
> >>  
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > For general EVDL support, see
> http://evdl.org/help/
> > For subscription options, see
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
> >
> >
> >
>
> --
> View this message in context:
>

http://www.nabble.com/Thunder-Sky-batteries-tp18330177p18524540.html

> Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List
> mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> For general EVDL support, see http://evdl.org/help/
> For subscription options, see
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>
>

_______________________________________________
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For subscription options, see http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev

[TODD KING]

Curious - What vehicle are you pushing Rod, and what's its range?  We were thinking of using 45 TS LFP090AHA for an S-10 conversion, but aren't sure if that will get us the 50-60 mile range that we're looking for, and that maybe we'd have to up it to 160AH or 200AH.

roddilkes wrote:

Just FYI I have a set of 45 TS LFP90AHA cells running in my EV for 18 months now.
They are still behaving like the day I bought them.

Regards, Rod Dilkes
www.ev-power.com.au

[roddilkes]

Jeff,

OC voltage can be up to 4.2V (safety limit) but drops back pretty quickly to 3.6V.
Nominal voltage is 3.2V - 3.3V, the cells will drop back to this voltage on discharge and stay there until about 70-80% discharged.

Rod

Jeff Mccabe wrote:

Hey Rod,
 I sent a quote request earlyer today for your bms
setup.
 I have another question though. What is the open
circuit voltage after the lfp cells come off the
charger. Say after at least 5minutes.
  I thinking of adding more cells to above my current
sla battery setup if I go with lfp200 to compensate
for say. I need to be below 190volts on my raptor 1200
controller before I precharge it or bad things can
happen :(
Thanks,
Jeff McCabe
--- roddilkes <[e-mail]> wrote:

>
> TS LFP (Iron Phosphate) and LCP (Cobalt) are
> different animals.
> LFP cells have a lower internal resistance so don't
> self heat much.
> At least from my experience...
>
> Rod
>
>
> Bill Dennis-2 wrote:
> >
> > For me right now, cold is not the problem--in
> fact, just the opposite.  
> > Temps are 35 degrees C right now.  And after I've
> climbed that hill to
> > home, my pack is up to 45 degrees C.  I'm actually
> going to have to add
> > some active cooling.
> >
> > Bill Dennis
> >
> > roddilkes wrote:
> >> Sag is temperature dependent.
> >> It is winter over here now with temperatures
> around 10-15 Celcius
> >> But I can still pull 3C (270A) without sagging
> below 2.5V per cell.
> >> Summer gives better performance in my experience.
> >>
> >> TS LFP do not provide the same performance as say
> Optima SLAs.
> >> For range there is no contest though.
> >>
> >> Regards, Rod Dilkes
> >> www.ev-power.com.au
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Roger Heuckeroth wrote:
> >>  
> >>> Just out of curiosity, how much voltage sag are
> you experiencing at  
> >>> load?  You say they are holding up, but at what
> performance?
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On Jul 17, 2008, at 10:41 AM, roddilkes wrote:
> >>>
> >>>    
> >>>> Just FYI I have a set of 45 TS LFP90AHA cells
> running in my EV for  
> >>>> 18 months
> >>>> now.
> >>>> They are still behaving like the day I bought
> them.
> >>>>
> >>>> Regards, Rod Dilkes
> >>>> www.ev-power.com.au
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> --
> >>>> View this message in context:
> >>>>
>
http://www.nabble.com/Thunder-Sky-batteries-tp18330177p18510061.html
> >>>> Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List
> mailing list archive  
> >>>> at Nabble.com.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>> For general EVDL support, see
> http://evdl.org/help/
> >>>> For subscription options, see
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ 
> >>>> ev
> >>>>      
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>> For general EVDL support, see
> http://evdl.org/help/
> >>> For subscription options, see
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>    
> >>
> >>  
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > For general EVDL support, see
> http://evdl.org/help/
> > For subscription options, see
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
> >
> >
> >
>
> --
> View this message in context:
>
http://www.nabble.com/Thunder-Sky-batteries-tp18330177p18524540.html
> Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List
> mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> For general EVDL support, see http://evdl.org/help/
> For subscription options, see
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>
>


_______________________________________________
For general EVDL support, see http://evdl.org/help/
For subscription options, see http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev

[roddilkes]

Suzuki Mighty Boy, the tiniest ute in the world, almost.
60km usable range.
You would require at least LFP160AHA and more like LFP200AHA for a large vehicle.

TODD KING wrote:

Curious - What vehicle are you pushing Rod, and what's its range?  We were thinking of using 45 TS LFP090AHA for an S-10 conversion, but aren't sure if that will get us the 50-60 mile range that we're looking for, and that maybe we'd have to up it to 160AH or 200AH.

roddilkes wrote:

Just FYI I have a set of 45 TS LFP90AHA cells running in my EV for 18 months now.
They are still behaving like the day I bought them.

Regards, Rod Dilkes
www.ev-power.com.au